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Orientation & Mobility Instruction During Hybrid and Virtual Learning: A Panel Discussion

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Presented by Julia Hedrick, Jenny Luttrell, and Patrick Rich (TSB) on 1/14/2021 Unity Virtual Academy 2020-2021 Session Description: This session will be a panel discussion with three certified O&M specialists discussing strategies they’ve used for providing orientation and mobility instruction during hybrid and virtual learning throughout 2020.

Show Transcript

bombs at Tennessee School for the Blind and I've been in the field for over 20 years and TSB I mostly work with the kids with complex needs as well as teenagers that have mild to moderate disabilities I have found virtual teaching to be very difficult as I keep wanting to see the kids with canes in their hands but it's kind of forced me to have concentrate on concept-development heavily are those kids with complex needs a generally really need a parent there with them who is willing and able to assist their stewed virtual teaching in this situation is really a team effort got to pull together your OT PT and speech people I relied heavily on our speech therapist because they awesome and they've given me a lot of great ideas and I learn something new from them all the time with complex needs students must have been working on simple Body Concepts such as by hearts and laterality working with him on learning where the top the back the friend the sides of their bodies are and I go over those with them and explain to the parent on how to assess didn't you were ready we work on left and right not only left and right hands but left and right body parts and then progressed from there to moving to the right moving to the left turning your head to the right to the left I have a song that I use couple left and right song it's on YouTube and I think I think it's in our resources and I start off the Listen by watching them through all the different motions that they'll need to do for the song and then we do the song so I'm going to show you what that looks like I always forget to do this sound okay this did I'm just show you just a couple minutes of it Gallagher right. boys and girls let's see if you can follow along as a single left and right song waving in the air play the most play them both to the right now clap your hands get your feet ready so as you can see it's a really good one because there's paases there some Natural Pawz sitting there that really help with getting the kids some transition time in the other thing that I really liked about this video is the character is older so it's no more age appropriate for a lot of our students one of the other things that I work on with this route which is something that I forget to do and a lot of times in the school setting is pointing and you know how a lot of kids will say find her up your your pointer finger and you get this you know and so learning how to point is a really important skill for owing them for when you're out and about and you want a heaven point to the direction that they if they're headed in and are getting them aligned up on the street and you want to have them points the direction you're going so I've got a song on here also about pointing and that's been a great one to use with Ally the kids are the ones that have difficulties with the left and the right I have simpler ones on here that go over to this very basic body parts and I try to include music for videos in in every lesson that I do kids just love that they're much more engaged I also work on sound discrimination by using a PowerPoint where I recorded. common sounds in the student has to guess what that sound is so let me see if I can pull that up I have one student asked for my burning Jenny just so you know we can only see the way document can only see the word document and now I don't have words are you able to hear these sounds okay okay I'm going to do the fire truck weigh here and then talk about that a lot of the sounds that I have on here are helicopter sound fire truck cars things that they would normally here in their environment and so I can use those a lot to really get them to you too working environment some of the sounds are home environment I have another resource on there that is a YouTube video of Transportation sounds and also sounds from around the home only problem with that one is it there's a curtain that goes up that squeaks and then as it comes down it squeaks in between each step down and that confuses some kids other kids are real able to quickly learn to kind of tune that out for the kids that are more academic we've been doing Virtual Field Trips and I found resource on Teachers Pay Teachers and it is it's fantastic you can go to Teachers Pay Teachers and put in Virtual Field Trip and you'll be able to either purchase them as a bundle or is individual and the great thing about that is we've done at Walmart to grocery Florida post office fast food restaurants is one for the mall I wish there was a way to share those but because they're purchased and they're also Google Docs there's no way to but a lot of times what I'll do is I'll take that that Google doc and convert it into a PowerPoint and then I can go in and add slide you emphasized Concepts like the one for Walmart I added a slide that said you know what to say this way to cross the parking lot is she ate that conversation and then what's the first thing you find when you go in to the grocery store what do you need to get first and I added a shopping cart and then the sound of a shopping cart and sell looking kind of play around with those but those have been a rate just a fantastic resource a lot of times I'll give them tell them we're going to go to the grocery store and buy everything you need to make a pizza and then it becomes you nowhere let's make a list and they have to come up with the things that we need to buy and then we talked about what departments we would go to to buy those things so that's been a really great way of getting those Concepts in in the kids really buy into it I had one student tell her mom don't don't talk to me we're playing store so they really they really like they really like those but it does allow us to talk about different departments and what's what's going on their post office 1 is great you know I think with Owen Amli forget a lot of times that about the concepts that are behind where they're going and so if we can go over those Concepts before we actually get there once we're back in school it makes it makes things make more sense for the students to talk about that it cost money to mail a letter after you purchase a stamp and how much do stamps cost and that there's a clerk in the counter in a line to go over all of those things and using those Virtual Field Trips as really helped me to kind of stay on track as far as what those skills are and what they need to learn I did the the virtual field trip to the post office with one student and we started talk about mailboxes and where they're usually located some students are in apartments so the another mail boxes are in different locations and if you're in a house they're usually at the end of your driveway and I had one student thought that the red flag was a way to lock the mailbox they didn't realize that that was something that indicated the postman that there was something in there that needed to be mailed so as frustrating as virtual teaching has been its worst me to concentrate on Concepts that I've kind of had to hurry through in the school environment and it's it's just kind play me slow down a little bit and and back up and and do those kinds of things so I hope that was helpful if you have any questions we're going to have a question time at the end so Juliet it's over to you all right so I am Julia Hedrick also tvi in Towns at tsv this is my eighteenth year at tsv in my 8-year doing full-time so I have done a lot of stand alone lessons on a variety of topics I'm going to share some of that you haven't or give me an idea of something similar you can do what is my favorite things that I have found and there are 10 episodes this was done by an onion tractor in Washington state last spring and she did the 10 episodes starting with Community has measurements on several of these now when I do these I don't just listen to call podcast straight through some of them like 20 minutes long but I'll do bits and pieces I'll listen ahead and mark the section that if you're doing a 45-minute lesson with a student who doesn't interact with you very much having somebody else do some of the talking of really help and also have the student here hear the same things you tell them from a different person like I didn't just make this up see this all in your person in Washington state is saying the same thing I tell you and I do how to get someone to understand play the very beginning of this sometimes she's like she's trying to be perky and energetic and it kind of sounds like she's talking to little kids even when the topic is old more advanced I'm in Germantown homebound for adventure helping students stay connected and engaged while quarantined she has hey to trivia questions and a profound sounds that you can guess and of course you didn't reveal the answers for the next week so if I do them I will play the previous weeks cuz she'll repeat the trivia question get gas and then she gives the answer and sing with the sound the song that kids really like to have that just as a fun thing if there's time with the end another thing I've used in a similar way is the virtual Excel Academy webinars the nice thing there is I have a listing of past recordings that you can use so I mean a list of upcoming went but I like to go to the old old ones because again oh I don't know it would be sort of Fortress to listen to the entire thing straight through but if you can just pull out sections again there's somebody else do some of the talking somebody else say some of the things in there several I listed on the resource sheet that relate to and I did a group lesson with some Middle School girls that my neighborhood was around me was the one and Anda the story of a story about onm and going for a walk into landmarks and clues and talked about sensory efficiency and then it had listening little listening things you to listen and try and predict the sound kind of freaky has a lot of it was like a car search car braking so they're pretty similar so enjoy it especially since we did it as a group lesson in that she got to interact with her friends was kind of nice some of them get a little Brian in the presentation next time please in Florida so you do definitely want to watch it ahead and just work just the sections you want to use and then some other things that I have done Tennessee rules for the road for understanding knowing the rules of the road can make you a safer pedestrian and then also have a student who has actually just recently received my kickstand is going to be learning to drive with my optic so course that was really interesting for him start learning about rules of the road so for him we would talk about as a driver but I will tell you say four as a pedestrian to know what the rules are for drivers and I used to practice test and there's there's two different links to practice test Jenny had one and I have a different one and I put them both on there and then same for like the manual but if you go through the practice test and just see how they do and that gives some good discussion I was actually really surprised how many of my students could not tell me the three colors of a traffic light and academic student who thought it was blue yellow and red and the blue was on top so you think she's thought surely you had to apparently I had not online shopping just going to walmart.com and have a student practice putting things in the cart and narrowing their search to get there more specific item how you changed your pick up store in your pickup. how to delete items how to check your running total this was a related still on the resources there's a link to an article from Perkins learning about the 15 addresses you should memorize on the college campus and I've used that just to kind of start the discussion about navigating college campuses what you're going to need to know and it didn't have a specific College in mind of pull up the campus map and talk about read out or come back to campus is and some of us the challenge researching several topics that one first though what are the things I have had students who are interested in dog guide School research okay what keeps coming up with things to look for in Center interested in a day I'll have him look at several different schools and List information and for dogs image you know is there a cost and bring it over the training and what kind of skills do you need in advance and then this one or transportation research if they live in an area or they'll think I'm going to college in an area with Paratransit so they can look up and know all of this information but also in Tennessee every county has some sort of World Transportation available a lot of it is weekday business hours only it's true the human resources agency is a lot of students are not aware of that and so having him look that up and knowing they don't have to apply anybody can use it it's not disability so having them look that up now I can I can take that and get the doctor and I can take that and get to work and so doing the transportation research for the dog out research and sometimes that can actually be a multiple most possession lesson which kind of makes the lesson planning a little simpler if you plan something that's that's an ongoing project I did another lesson on addresses and I use the podcast from home bound for Adventure on dresses by interspersed it with other things and one of the things I included that comes up in the students don't know the abbreviation the other names for a street and all the abbreviations and stuff they see a street name but I hear it on GPS and it may not so now I'm going to GPS it'll say like Elm CT instead of court and so we went through what they're all those abbreviation stand for and what are all those names for roads and comparing like what does an envelope compared to what do you need to know plan your route into what do you need to put into GPS and we went over to state abbreviations even though you don't usually do need that 401m that just does a little side thing and zip codes what information you can get in and out of analyze an address and talk about will it talks about the compass directions in the address and that the address is starting to the center of town and in the bigger the address is for the you are from the center of town north of downtown I've done some like like Jenny's virtual field trip with post office I just have students like look up what goods and services are available at different Community Resources like at the post office the library just turned out what you already know what can you do you know that you can do at these places and like I'm just not very much and I will look up some things and talk about it together and I like to go to their specific County Library website and see if available and talk about that there are things a lot of students don't really realize that there's a lot that they can access even if they don't read the regular print but there's digital materials and downloads in movies and music and all the programs and that you can use the computer at the library and also it was just kind of fun I found a lot of unusual things that different libraries offer some of the National Armory she can check out a ukulele and a little how to play the so I was just kind of fun and there was one Library where you can check out tools so you're going to work on a project and then a lot of the libraries have seeds that you can obviously don't return them but they still calling to check out so I was just don't know that that stuff is available and then I did a lesson related to this I have a student who is an academic student he almost never goes anywhere and he has no what is that stores and what where you would go to find specific items and so I made a chart and I just group stores in two categories and I've listed with these doors have these items and I just put an X they had it I broke it down into sound like they would have limited and then he was in very few and we looked at me we didn't go through the chart line by line but we look through some of the highlights of the chart and then I gave him a worksheet that listed five items like okay if you have these five items which store which kind of store would you go to to might be able to buy all these items because almost every list you can go to Walmart but where else could you do besides to Target that would also have these items then we talked about why sometimes you might choose to use to go to a different store that you're considering price you're considering selection available on you're considering quality of items and do for a student who really doesn't go any place and we can't go anyplace even when we're on campus we can't go into stores because it's kind of a good way to give him a little bit more idea of what some different stores carry where you go different things cease me and then probably going to talk more about route planning but that's a I'll have done this with maps student I've got some students with some brown maps have been some route planning planning bus routes this something else I worked on with my high school students there are and importantly I haven't got to use this with any students yet because they came in the mail right before right before we went out not realizing we were be out for an extended time and I didn't get these in any students hands but this is from the lighthouse in San Francisco and their tactical intersection diagrams and eventually I look forward to trying some of those with students and I think that's and you can do virtually the book at home and I you had a copy you to discuss different features of intersections and they're really really cool looking forward to trying them if they just stay here we didn't get them in her hands I haven't really got to try them out and then with one of my Vance High School graduating students we're doing a long-term project for she's planning a trip to another city go anywhere in the US you wanted to go where would you go and so she chose San Francisco so we are planning a trip and she's planning just got to look it up how would you make a plane reservation and how are you going to get to the airport and how are you going to get from the Airport to downtown where you going to stay what places would you want to be sure and visit when you're in San Francisco and let's find out about the public transportation to get to a place that so that's a multiple of ongoing project who's getting grants for her to learn about those things she has somebody who would like to go places that's good experience for her an easy lesson planning for me as a ongoing project and I don't know if you've ever used the website rome2rio and it's a good starting point for for like long-term travel it gives you all the choices of You by Bastille Oakland fly to San Jose and then take the BART transportation and it breaks it down it shows the price and how long it takes when I told her the bus took two days and eight hours she was really young quite certain she was not interested in so she decided she wanted to plan flying to San Jose and then taking the light rail the wrestler because it was the cheapest so we'll have to see once he gets into it but how you know how do I get from the airport to the white Raven when is that going to be a project that's been working for us and then other thing is just exploring different apps a lot of them are not specific 400nm but they might have some onm related uses and just kind of brainstorming with a student how could you use this way Abby specular rejects picture something and it was it was a question in the volunteer can type or send an audio reply I just took the picture of a cereal box and just ask what kind of cereal is this and I got several answers really quickly if you haven't played with sing it all right it's it's got really great options and it's got a really easy to use currency reader it's that settings to read long document short documents to read handwritten document it'll read barcodes on items and then Envision AI is the Android similar app but one of my music more she feels like it's gotten worse accurate so she is a bit more now there's a separate money reader app and then older students if they've ever use Ira or talking about how you could use her I wouldn't have to download running around your house with Ira you get up to 5 minute free calls every 24 hours so that's kind of knew they didn't used to do that if you just need five minutes you can call and you don't have any kind of a package or anything but just one call 24 hours and then it's free and certain locations that's one of the things I was really looking forward to trying with one of my students last spring and didn't get to but all Walgreens locations you can use Ira freeze many minutes do you know till you find out items you need at Walgreens some airports and I read recently they're starting to add it in certain Starbucks crying it out and then subscriptions for longer uses are available so they're not familiar with they need to be can be independent Travellers in the be my eyes is for IOS and Android free version of Ira but the people don't have the same kind of training but I got some advice from some student some people I know who is different apps who have visual impairments and what I'm said is great and they're trained but sometimes if you just need a quick something instead of using his minutes he'll he'll call up being my eyes I'm in the block Imma Be My Eyes volunteer and it is usually it's something really quick like what is the expiration date on this right one gentleman that wanted he couldn't tell if the that he had to put mail into the envelope so it should go through the window she couldn't tell whether or not it was showing through the window but it does take I mean working with big impaired people I know how to describe things but I could see where the answers would vary based on Guinness cuz you know you have to be very specific for somebody who's totally visually and you know he just ate round right I could see where you were what you would get two very greatly right right and he said he knows he's in the right block but he can't tell exactly by the entrance is you know he might use it for something like that doesn't know any related so just making sure that older students are there at least aware of even if they're not ready to use he's that so I'm not going to tell kids to download an app is there 18 and they want to that's fine I just make sure they're aware of them so they can think about using them in the future so I think that covers what I have Patrick alright how's everyone's brains feeling I know that was a lot of information coming too fast so what I'm going to be talking about there's a lot about just planning bus routes and intersection Crossings and that kind of stuff so I'm I'm doing more with I'm working more with the more advanced high school kids from TSP virtually and I'm seeing kids in person for outreach a lot so I'm only seeing kids maybe once a week or every other week virtually 40 SD and our lessons tend to be a little bit longer so I'm working a lot more on concept development and working on how to how you would plan complex bus routes and that's something that we don't get to do a lot in person because when we're seeing each other we're typically out and about so I've been really using this time to make sure kids understand what we're talking about when we are going out and doing his bus route first before we get started to share screen this one this a share screen at the bottom open system preferences maybe I maybe I haven't done something right already yeah it's saying share screen and then I'm saying now it's not letting me share my screen oh my gosh I'm sorry everybody I hate when this happens when I'm on a zoom and now I'm the one okay hold on hold on say hi to do something in Riviera it's saying I have to change the privacy or something now okay well I'm going to try to talk while I do this so when we're doing bus routes and talking about that a lot of the times what you need to really think about is how you're trying to get a student to understand what you're talking about so when you're okay so let's say when you're starting you're going to be talking saying okay so what we are going to do now is we're going to be traveling from from our location to Walmart and something that you really have to consider when your star is what the home base is going to be so a lot of times you you have to think about where you're starting so if your student lives in a rural area that might not be a good spot to start from and I like to make sure that it's a consistent starting point so what I do what I do is I do TSB most of the time because we're right where you want to be so if you needed to be I'm just not going to share my screen I'll be all live so if you are working with the students in a really were Larry maybe that's not a good place to start from home but if there's School who is closer to more businesses and and a little less rollover area their school might be a good spot to start so and I like to keep that starting spot very consistent throughout my lessons at least at the beginning so when you first start playing these route you're going to say okay we're going from in my case Tennessee School for the Blind to Walmart and you're going to say okay let's do that and you're going to have the student pull out their phone and go on the Google whatever and go to maps and say okay we're going to directions to Walmart from wherever and then they're going to hit public transit and it should be relatively easy for them to get that first route down you can Siri you can use Google whatever if you're using Google you just type in whatever place you want to go and then I'll say directions you hit directions and then you just make sure they find public transit if you're using Siri you need to be very specific you need to say directions to Walmart 4424 Lebanon Pike by bus and you have to be very specific what Walmart or what Target you want to go to you just say Target it's going to give you a list of a thousand Target and the students going to get overwhelmed especially if they don't have the vision to access it is voice over or whatever just going to start going crazy reading out Target Target Target no one is going to know what you what car do you want to go to so once you make that decision you're going to go you're going to say okay you can go where you need to go to store and get sit down we're good to go then once you finally get the student to get the first route he said I now it's go backward and start over now we're going to get go there and back so the route there just to kind of get them figuring out how they want to how how how everything works and it should be a relatively quick process there and back is when it starts to get confusing if you get there they'll get that down pretty well and they have to reverse it and then coming back almost every kid makes the same mistake to start and it's kind of Bank on them making that mistake the route back we'll leave before they get there cuz they're just going to do a leave now so if they're leaving now to go to Walmart they might get to Walmart at 4:45 then their route back will be leaving Walmart at 4:30 to come back oh you can't do that what time do we get to Walmart for 45 more than how we leaving Walmart at 4:30 O Okay so that's a good way to start talking about depart app versus arrive by and this is where I live my students have a lot of difficulty so I have spent a lot of time talking about the depart at and arrive by and what the differences are so you kind of break it down to okay when we're talking about a bus route what do we know you always know where you're starting where you're going you also know if you need to be somewhere at a certain time versus do you need to leave at a certain time that's always the information you're going to have no matter but even if it's I don't care when I leave and I don't care when I get there it's you know what time you want to leave it's now or whenever so you can just say depart at whenever but if you need to be home before curfew do you need be out of movie theater because the movie starts at 5 you know what time you need to arrive by and that really trips up a lot of my kids so we spend a lot of time talking about that so once can finally get them to understand okay we're going to go from here to Walmart we get to Walmart at 4:45 now we have to hit the depart at or the arrive by button which one are we looking at we're hitting the depart at and then it's going to be 4:45 and then we'll find out what bus we can take after 4:45 to come back and then we can that's how I really enter concept once we start getting a little bit more complex is where I have some students that can do this and I have one student who can do an incredible job but a lot of kids have a lot of trouble just trying to figure out that part so once you have a student that can really get good with the simple there and back bus routes I start introducing a little bit more complexity I say okay I'm we're leaving from Homebase which for us is the Tennessee School for the Blind it's in Nashville it's pretty close to downtown so I can say okay the Tennessee Titans game is at 1 I want to go out to lunch or some of my buddies beforehand at wherever Phat bites it's a sandwich ShopRite nearby I want to go out to lunch for an hour and then we're going to the Tennessee Titans game starts at 1 The Games 3 hours long and then we have to get back and that just blows kids mind the first time you say that but okay we have a lot to break down here but once you really think about it it's not that bad you have to thank each piece of it what information do we have the information we have set in stone is the game starts at 1 we know where the game is it's at Nissan Marina so we start from there okay we're how we getting to the game we're getting there from fat bikes the restaurant so we've been we're going to get that bus route from restaurant to games is that the part out or arrived cry if you arrive by arrive by 1 so we get that info that will tell us what time we have to leave the restaurant now we know where want one hour to eat so minus another hour we now we know from Tennessee School for the Blind to the restaurant what time we have to get to the rest so we really quickly we already have School for the Blind restaurant restaurant 2 game pretty easily and it's not that hard if you just sit and think about it for a couple of minutes and then I'm really pushing with my kids is too think and that's such a simple concept but a lot of kids just Panic immediately when you give them something hard and I know a lot of you guys agree with me and have been through that oh I see that sounds hard I'm not doing it that's too hard nope you can have to give me something easier so I like to push my kids and they hate me at the moment for it but they get better and then you can say okay now we are at the game games over one good job we're in the playoffs I guess you didn't win in the playoffs but this is I did this before we lost so okay Games 3 hours long ends at 4 got to get back is that a depart at or arrive oh oh oh it's the depart at with the Department game at 4 leave the game for come back so then another thing I like to say is okay well you're going back to Tennessee School for the Blind going home wherever you have to be home you have a curfew that's at 6 if you don't if you're not coming if you don't come back your ground if you don't get your Xbox you get your phone taken away whatever and you can talk about what curfew is 7. Rising number of kids that don't know what curfew means so you say okay well now you have two bits of information you know what time you have to leave somewhere and you know what time you have to get somewhere which one is more report seeing the last 2 minutes of the game or being back and not losing your Xbox in your PlayStation and whatever oh yeah being back I don't want to lose that so sometimes you have to think about what is the more pressing okay I have to be back at a certain time no matter what it doesn't matter what time I leave even though the game ends at a certain time so I use a lot of time and a lot of energy with my kids I'll give them one or two routes in an hour-long rap lesson but a lot of it is just step by step processing and thinking through situations and why are we doing this I'll give him questions and safe why are you leaving why is it a ride by do not depart at and a lot of times are just guessing cuz they don't know so I spend probably more time that I'll honestly should grilling and questioning kids why why why why no matter what the answer is and they start to think I'm trying to trick them all the time so give him a question they'll get it right and I'll say why no or maybe it was the other one at all why I don't know maybe start yyyyy and make them really you can just see the smoke coming out of their ears sometimes because they just a lot of these kids aren't pushed and may need to ask why why they think something may just say an answer and then it's over so that's what I'm really trying to push to you guys as in your lessons ask why do million times ask why they're giving you that answer why they think a certain way that kind of stuff I did have one thing I wanted to share with you guys but my apparently I didn't want to parent I didn't hit the correct screen sharing preferences and that's on me but it's really easy I just went on Google and I typed in play intersection and there's a bunch of little cartoon images great intersections the one I had specifically was a two-lane intersection going north-south and a two-lane road going north and south One Way each Direction and then another one going East-West with a turn lane in the middle and that was a great one and I like to share my screen with kids and some for some reason it works when I'm doing I do share my screen and I'll say okay we're standing at the southwest corner where is Southwest and that takes another 10 minutes but I'm just kind of figure out where Southwest is but once we get there okay we're going to cross counterclockwise where is search and even if they don't have the picture in front of them a lot of kids can visualize it in their head that okay if I'm crossing counter-clockwise that means I'm going this way okay if I'm going that way but traffic is going to be on my the traffic is on your left where is your surge coming from and then Julia had a great point of a great saying I still used to this day of left behind right ahead if the traffic is on your right your surges in front of you we left the surges behind you so I use that a lot and I just kind of go through and walk through my walk through a lot of situations with my kids now and I know this is a panel for discussion and I have a question are you guys I know everyone just wants to sit here and hear me talk but sorry I want to hear what you guys have to say has anyone maybe I'm too dumb to figure it out or maybe I just don't have enough technology technological prowess is anyone use a real Fresco Grill display while doing Google Maps or any of the transportation stuff to get the directions on a braille display because I was trying to do it and I know it works and I just couldn't figure it out and I've been sitting hours on end for the past two weeks banging my head against the stable trying to see how my kids can do it so easily and I can't so if anyone has any tips and pointers for me I can I'll take them with open arms but that's all I have on that if anyone has any questions has any comments wants to tell any of us that we're dumb or that we are awesome we'll take that right now I want to say Patrick you said about Googling intersections at almost used one and at the last minute realized it was British and all the cars are going the wrong direction so open. Us. I'm not. UK and that is just something good for a lot of kids like I do a lot I like to do a lot of intersection stuff and all these kids almost guaranteed haven't left the house and we or if they do they're going with mom and dad they're not getting that practice so even just getting the mental repetitions is Big just saying okay we're at this intersection and explain the whole picture okay and again I work the higher-functioning kids I work with the high schoolers that have this kind of practice and knowledge and everything like that so it's a little bit easier for me to do that if Jenny were trying to do that with her transition in elementary school a complete nightmare train wreck so you make sure you know who you're talkin to who you're working with and develop a plan that works for those students specifically in for the love of God asked why if you can take any pain from my from me just key compounding his kids why why why why do you say that why are you thinking this why do you want to do this and because you'll get some crazy answers but you'll really start to believe I understand their thought processes on things and is kind of what our jobs are is to put kids in situations that they wouldn't normally be in in but keep it in a controlled situation our jobs really at the end of the day or to prepare students in these kids tube in situations that they don't want aren't planning to be in but but now they're ready for it because they practiced it with us so that's all I have to say thank you guys for coming out I had a great job I had a migraine I did a great job thank you had a great time talking with any you guys if anyone has any comments or questions and wants to reach out to any of us all of our emails or just are named Patrick Patrick Jamie Luttrell. Tigers. Org and we love to reach out and chat with you which is mobility with the Red Cap survey length if anyone didn't catch in the chat I'll put the new Google doc that Julian the opening code Mobility opening closing code Mobility all right they won't have any comments concerns anything they would like to add to anyting Google Maps when you were doing the arrive at and depart that was something I wanted to talk about and I had it in a PowerPoint but my mess something up and I forgot to go over that there is a difference between Google Maps and Apple Maps there's not a big different so if you're using Siri is going to default go to Apple Maps and if you're using Android it'll typically default go to Google Maps I find with voice over it works a little bit better with Apple Maps it doesn't really mean you're both going to get where you want to be on either map platform so doesn't matter really it's up to the student and what they're more comfortable with I like using Google I'm an iPhone user bus like using Google Maps just I don't know why I just trust Google for some reason but if there is a student's using voice over I find it's a little bit more seamless with Apple Maps than Google Maps it's a little bit more straw for it's a little less crazy but they both do have the option for depart at arrive by transit he'll tell you what bus number either need to get on with they're going to do a transfer that kind of stuff they both work I didn't try ways or any of those other crazy apps I just stuck with the big two I will I'm going to stop the recording

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